Episode 63: Former SO Member Nora Ames

October 26 Episode 63: Former SO Member Nora Ames

Leah and Mike welcome Nora Ames, former SO member and outspoken whistleblower concerning the hypocrisy of scientology’s rampant homophobia. She has one of the most incredible and harrowing escape from the Sea Org stories as well as what she did to get her mother out of scientology. Both her father and mother were scientology Guardian Office workers.

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View Documents (9)
Why you can't be gay in scientology

Nora’s powerful video from 2016

The Guardian's Office/Office of Special Affairs

When you Google Guardian’s Office this is what you get from Wikipedia

Fair Game
Sentencing Memorandum excerpts

Excerpts from the DOJ Sentencing Memorandum in the criminal case against Mary Sue Hubbard and other leaders of the Guardian’s Office

View/Download Document
What Judges say about scientology
Scientology and Law
Scientology's version of litigation
"Murder Routine"

The term as defined by L. Ron Hubbard in the official scientology dictionary

Scientology Homophobia

My earlier blog post on the subject


  • Allison M says:

    I love this podcast. I wait for each episode with anticipation. But today. Today. *sigh* I wanted to hear what Nora had to say. I stopped at 26:58. Leah, you are 100% entitled to your opinions, and this is your podcast, so you can 100% say whatever you want. But I also 100% am entitled to my opinion, and when you started with the “white privilege” thing, my heart sank. I cannot believe you have bought into that lie, but be that as it may, here are some points to ponder;

    1. You are white. (So am I, although I do have First Nations and African DNA way back on my father’s side of the family.)
    2. You life a live of privilege thanks to your hard work and celebrity. (After a life of working incredibly hard for everything that I have – which isn’t much – I am anything but “privileged.”) You might want to hesitate before pointing the privilege finger at anyone else. FTR, I don’t begrudge your celebrity privilege at all. I just don’t like hypocrisy.
    3. Judges today are generally part of the “woke” crowd. The “92 year old white privileged male” judges are quickly becoming extinct. So if judges aren’t doing what you think they should do, you should consider the reality modern activist judge wokeness.

    Maybe later I can muster the grit to listen to the rest of this podcast. We shall see. Maybe I’ll stick to getting my Scientology updates from Aaron Smith-Levin.

  • Jimmy says:

    Damn good episode. Nora Ames’s story would make for a great movie. I like how Leah is a strong advocate for women in politics while also bolstering the “Women be crazy on there periods” trope

  • Ben A says:

    Love the Podcast! You and Leah do fantastic work.

    When you, Leah, and Nora discuss Mission Earth you all describe it as “mandatory reading.” How exactly does the Church of Scientology make readings like that “mandatory”?

  • Daisy says:

    Loving the podcast, (and I appreciate the definitions of terms because I’m newish) but you really need to give a warning before you discuss attempting suicide! That can be reproblematic for people who have had issues in the past. As a member of the LGBTQ community this is something that is really important.

  • Dorte Christiansen says:

    hi Leah and Mike.
    I know, this isn’t exactly a question you expect, but it has been nagging me, to be asked…
    is Angelina Jolie a member of Scientology?
    – reason for this question; the tactics, by Jolie and her legal team, in the custodycase between her and Brad Pitt, reminds me quite a lot of LRH’s policy of “To Destroy Him Utterly”

    Dorte Christiansen,

  • Jeff Hunter says:

    Long-time listener, first-time commenter. I normally hate podcasts, this is one of the only ones I listen to, and I check out every episode.

    Question: Leah brought up at one point how Scientologists don’t care when someone dies because they’ll just “pick up a new body.” Has anybody ever actually been able to “re-enter” Scientology by claiming they’re the spirit of a former Scientologist?

  • Kate says:

    Hi Leah and Mike,
    Love the podcast and the series, have watched and listened “religiously” haha.
    I just had a question regarding vaccinations? It was mentioned in passing in this episode. Do Scientologists believe in vaccinations? Have they discouraged their constituents to refuse the COVID vaccination? Furthermore, do they believe COVID exists or are they saying it’s government propaganda? I know the Jehovah’s Witnesses are saying COVID symbolises the end of days, I was curious whether Scientology is capitalising on their members’ fears regarding this disease and creating anti Vax and anti lockdown hysteria.

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